There is an obvious difference between experimenting with animals and experimenting on human subjects. For human subjects, we need their informed consent for this experimentation to be licit. There is, however, a debate as to how to go about experimenting on humans when they are incapacitated to give consent. The obvious solution is that the informed consent should be provided by their proxies. But what about those we are not yet born? Can we ethically experiment on human embryos?
In spite of the recent interest in experimenting in embryos for embryonic stem cell research, experimentation on human embryos is always illicit. “If the embryos are living, whether viable or not, they must be respected just like any other human person. Experimentation on embryos which is not directly therapeutic, is illicit. No objective, no matter how noble in itself, such as a foreseeable advantage to science, to other human beings or to society , can in any way, justify experimentation on living human embryos or fetuses, whether it is viable or not, regardless if it is inside or outside the mother’s womb.
The informed consent ordinarily required for clinical experimentation on adults cannot be granted by the parents, who may not freely dispose of the physical integrity or life of the unborn child.” (Donum vitae, I, 4). Pope John Paul II spoke clearly about it as well, “I condemn, in the most explicit and formal way, experimental manipulations of the human embryo, since the human being, from conception to death, cannot be exploited for any purpose whatsoever.” (AAS 75 (1983) 37).
But, what about cybrids? They are not technically humans because they do not come from a human egg and human sperm. Does the ethical rule of absolute respect for human embryos also apply to embryonic human cybrids?
Let us imagine, for the sake of discussion, that, one day, a group of anthropologists discovers in a remote island a strange creature which they have never seen before. They observe that this creature looks quite human. In fact, it shows all the human traits we have. What puzzles scientists is that this creature is not born from other female members of the species but surprisingly and inexplicably, grows from trees. A human-like bud develops in a tree, the bud blooms into a flower, and after 9 months, a human-like creature is born. The whole world is confused and mesmerized about this human-like creature. Soon some scientists decide that the scientific thing to do is to retrieve a few specimens, kill them and dissect them for experimentation. Would that be reasonable?
No, it would not. There is a basic ethical rule that forbids acting in the face of doubt as to what we are doing. If during hunting season, someone notices some movement behind the bushes, is he allowed to shoot? No, it is not permissible since what is moving behind the bushes could either be a person or an animal. It would not be a responsible thing to shoot before confirming that what is moving is indeed an animal and not a person.
We cannot act responsibly and therefore ethically before we resolve the doubt or ignorance as to what we are really doing — in our case, shooting an animal or a person. When in doubt, one should never shoot. This is common sense. The same rule would apply for this “strange new creature”. Until we know, beyond any reasonable doubt, that what we are dissecting is not a human creature, scientists should refrain from harming this creature in any way.
The human cybrid would be such a creature. For all we know, it is more likely to be human than non-human. We know this because previous clones resemble the donor of the cellular nucleus –in fact they are almost genetically identical– more than they resemble the donor of the egg, in our case, the animal.
Scientists agree with this similarity with humans. In a recent dispute in UK over this fact, UK scientists accused the Catholic church of misinterpreting their scientific enterprise. The Bishops’ Conference issued a letter to be read in all parishes warning their congregation against the evil intention of scientists to create half-human-half-animal embryos. UK scientists snapped accusing the bishops of “violating the truth”.
This is not so, the scientists contended. These cybrids are “devoid of an animal genetic identity” said scientist, Stephen Minger. “The resulting embryo contains only human genes”. The scientists have spoken — albeit, inaccurately, presumably on purpose. The truth is that the resulting embryo contains mostly human genes, but it would still harbour a bit of the animal genetic material held in the egg’s mitochondria. The main point to bring home from this dispute, however, is that, as far as science can say, this embryo is genetically mainly human.
The only consistent conclusion is that if human embryos should be absolutely respected, so should be the embryonic human cybrids. They should be respected regardless of our doubts about their real nature. They should still be respected, and all the more, since we scientifically know that they are “genetically” mainly human. The only reasonable thing to do is to give them the benefit of the doubt and protect them with the same respect the normal human embryos deserve. That is, not exerting on them any experimentation, and allowing them to grow and mature according to the best capacity of their nature.
The fact that these cybrids are not found in a remote island but are deliberately created for research purposes and will eventually be terminated makes this act even more illicit.
Embryonic Stem Cell research has brought us down an ethical slippery slope. Countries where such research is allowed, cannot even find any more grounds to draw ethical norms regarding human cybrids. The ethical challenge of the moral status of cybrids only demonstrates how wrong embryonic stem cells research was, in the first place.





February 26, 2008 at 7:05 am
[...] In spite of the recent interest in experimenting in embryos for embryonic stem cell research, experimentation on human embryos is always illicit. “If the embryos are living, whether viable or not, they must be respected just like any … Read More [...]
May 23, 2008 at 4:46 am
It is not as simple as you suggest.
These issues need to be considered more carefullyt if the Church is to avoid another Galileo case.
Is insert of a single human gene into an animal or bacteria egg or cell acceptable. Hard to avoid the conclusion that it is acceptable. A gene can be obtain from an ordinary cell. What would be the objection to insertion in a bacteria to obtain a protein that another human is deficient in producing.
What then about a full chromosome. It is after all a set of gens so where is an ethical boundary crossed?
What then of a cybrid where the animal egg has been rendered incapable of reproducing beyond say a eight cell stage. This could be done to the animal egg and so what would be the objection to that.
Cybrids are produced by fusing a human skin cell with the egg of a animal cell from which the nucleus has been removed. (The animal cell would retain its mitochondria as you are aware.)
No human egg is involved. The resulting cell can divide but not develop into an embryo beyond a certain point.
It is not sufficient to just wave your arms and assert that there is an issue. It needs much more thought than that I suggest.
I look forward to hearing more.
May 23, 2008 at 8:18 am
Dear Pat,
in no way i say this is an simple subject. It is extremely difficult. Specially if you consider the opposite or if you stant thinking about it in terms of mere genetic engineering. As you said, ‘nothing wrong with inserting one gene’, then why not two, and why not a whole chromosome, etc. But this is not the case. Basically i answered the question of cybrids in the following articles. See, “Brave New Singapore…” in this blog. The difference is that a cybrid is “practically a human embryo” (even if not technically 100% genetically human). In other words, it is human enough for us to halt. It is a common ethical principle that when we do not have full knowledge of the consequences of an act potentially harmful, in conscience we should not act, lest we find ourselves involved in an unethical position.
The fact that the embryo would be destroyed after few days and never develop into an adult is totally irrelevant to the ethics of the act of creating cybrids and it only adds to the illicitness of the act because amounts to the destruction of a “practically human embryo”. Morality of an act is to be measured, not only from the consequences of your action, but primarily by the action itself. The circunstances only add to it. Even if the embryo is in itself incapable of fruther development, which we do not know yet, it does not mean that we are allowed to fabricate human life.
I do not know your background so I do not know what to presume you know or don’t know about how to navigate ethical troubled waters like bioethics. At least discussing about it, can bring more clarifications and mutual understanding, i believe. Thanks. fr david OP
May 24, 2008 at 4:34 pm
First let me say I appreciate the tone of your reply.
Turning to the core issue I am interested in analysing more closely the specifics.
As you are aware humans and other mammals have many identical genes and only a small proportion of human genes are unique to humans.
At present the human gene for producing insulin is added into bacteria (or into yeast) to produce insulin for human use. (see http://www.accessexcellence.org/RC/VL/GG/transfer_and.php)
The following headline reports that the same process is on offer for 35,000 human genes. (“QIAGEN and GENEART Partner to Commercialize Synthetic Human Genes”)
The process described above is it seems ethically acceptable because it can never lead to an embryo i.e a complete replicating set of human cells. It simply results in a bacteria that produces a human protein (i.e human in the sense that humans require and produce it). The bacteria does however have a human gene that has been introduced into it. The Cardinal in the UK who suggested that “mixing human and animal genes is crazy” was apparently unaware that bacteria and human genes are being mixed right now.
Most of the worlds diabetics depend on insulin produced by the process described above to survive.
I would be interested in your view on the mixing of bacteria or yeast and human genes I describe. I am not suggesting that accepting that leads automatically to a view on the cybrid case but it would be helpful to know whether you consider I have missed a point here.
Turning to the cybrid case let us assume that that the following steps are possible:
1. Take a cow egg and apply a process that ensures it cannot develop beyond say 10 cell divisions;
That cannot be unethical since it is a cow egg.
2. Remove the nuclear DNA but leave the rest of the cell including the mitochrondria and their DNA – which is a very small segment (16,500 bases versus 3,000,000,000 bases in human nuclear DNA)
That cannot be unethical since it is a cow egg.
3. Take a skin cell and extract is its nuclear DNA – we all shed millions every hour of every day so extracting the DNAthat cannot be unethical. In any event ist is no different from taking a blood sample is it.
3. Fuse the DNA with the cows eggs resulting in a cell that has human DNA in its nucleus and cow mitochrondria
3. The cybrid cell is not capable of developing beyond say 10 cell divisions
4. The “egg” can be induced to divide by shocking it with an electric shock. It can be divided further but only for 10 cell divisions. Before it has divided 10 times some of the cells can be removed for separate culture (It must be remembered that all cells can be induced to divided not just embryos or eggs).
The approach you have taken is to argue that the cybrid cell must be regarded as a separate live entity with the status of a separate human. This is in my view hard to defend. After all all cells can normally be induced to divide. You cannot argue that they all represent separate live entities with the status of a separate human. That would imply that it is unethical to experiment on any cell since it could be induced to divide. That doesn’t hold up as an argument.
I will leave the matter there. My point is simply that the issues are complex.
May 24, 2008 at 7:29 pm
Yes, complex indeed. But there is a huge difference between embryos and other kinds of cells. And that is the whole point. If the embryo is human, we cannot experiment on it. And inducing an egg to divide causes an embryo, which is a living individual (or twins) of a given species. This is very different from any other kind of cell induced to divide by mitosis, which simply creates more of one type of cells, but not a new individual.
Because these issues are complicated it is good to dialogue about them and see other people’s point of view. Thanks for your contribution. I hope it helps all of us think about issues that are extremely important.
May 25, 2008 at 11:26 am
Thanks Fr David,
I should explain that I am shortly to participate in a discussion group on these issues which has been convened in part in response to the UK approval of cybrids. I saw your comments when I did a web search under cybrids and it is helpful to be able to discuss the issues with you. Hopefully others may find our dialogue helpful too.
I would like, if I may, to follow up on one issue.
As I noted human insulin for use by diabetics is produced by adding the human gene for insulin to a bacteria or to yeast cells which then produce human insulin when in a suitable medium i.e when “grown as a colony”. In the past insulin for this purpose was obtained from animals but the insulin they produce is different in small details from human insulin which is not good for diabetics.
The New Zealand dairy industry is busy working on adding various human genes to cows with a view to their producing important human proteins. The addition is done by using viruses to add the human gene to the nuclear DNA of the cow egg. This work is still in trial stages because of concerns regarding side effects of various types. (As I noted a partnership to produce synthetic human genes i.e. DNA segments identical to the segments in human DNA but produced in isolation has been announced and this will be a soyrce of genes to be added to cows DNA).
The obvious point is that it seems to me hard to argue that there is anything unethical about adding a number of human genes to a cows eggs in this way. The egg will then be fertilized with bull sperm and the fertilized egg will be implanted in a cow resulting in calves that incorporate human genes. these cows will produce specific specialised human proteins in their milk. If they produced the correct protein and it could be absorbed in the gut this might cure cystic fibrosis for example.
Clearly the above differs from the cybrid where all the cow nuclear DNA is replaced with a complete set of human DNA (i.e. a complete set of chromosones). Nevertheless the two examples can be seen as blending into one another in as much as in the cybrid all the cow DNA is replaced whereas in the other case human genes are being added and cow genes remain.
At present only the additional human gene is only a small proportion of the DNA in the genetically modified cow egg. I am sure you can see however that the distinction between the cases could be argued by some to be a matter of degree rather than a matter of principle.
I hope you will appreciate I am asking this not as a trick question but because in all worthwhile discussions about ethics it is important to think through the ramifications and robustness of the principles that are proposed as a basis for conclusions.
Thanks Pat Duignan
P.S The discussion group in tomorrow (Monday) night.
May 25, 2008 at 8:49 pm
Yes, you are right. There is nothing wrong with adding one gene that we know will not harm anyone and bring known benefitial effects. The argument against cybrids does not run “it is illicit to mix man and human DNA.” The ethical assesment of those procedures should be measured in terms of proportional benefit to the human person. As you note, cybrids is a different case, since it is the whole nuclear DNA, which lead us to assume that it is a practically human embryo, which is the very reason why they want to create them. They just want cheaper, more readily available human eggs to produce human embryonic stem cells lines.
However the difficult question is the one you rightly bring up. If one gene could be “OK” but all the chromosomes is not ok, where do we draw the line? Is 5 genes ok? It is only one chromosome ok? Where do we draw the line?
We have a parallel case with human organs. It is ok to transplant an animal organ to a human. But should we transplant heads? or testicles, or ovaries? Obviously the question changes seriousness. Where do we draw the line?
It appears reasonable that we draw the line at human identity. That is, we draw the line at those organs that not only perform a physiological function but have some more important role to play in the identity of the species or the person. It appears that surgical exchanging of heads has been practiced in dogs. Would that be advisable in humans should the question or the need arise one day. Since it seems that the brain is not just an organ that performs a function but it is directly linked with the personality and character of the person, transplanting the head would amount to transplanting something personal (and not just biological).
Similar issue with gonads. Whose children are the children borne from a transplanted ovary? It seems that here more than just a function is involved and the genetic identity of the person is involved.
Now we can think about genes. My personal opinion would be. We can transfer only the genes of which we know certainly, beyond reasonable doubt, that will not affect the personality or identity of the person. Obviously, transferring the whole nuclear DNA does. Obviously, transferring the gene for insulin, does not. So one is licit and welcome; the other one is not.
These issues are complicated and will become more complicated. They are difficult to understand and more difficult to explain. But all need serenity, deep thinking, open mind, and skills in dialogue to help each other to direct the future research through the right path.
Thanks for your questions. I hope your discussion goes well. I am very happy to try to help. Just let me know if I did not explain myself well.
May 28, 2008 at 6:14 pm
Thanks Fr David,
We had very wide ranging discussion. I think your comments sum up the complications well. I note that the idea of transfer of an altered full set of human nuclear DNA which cannot develop as an embryo is a possible way of addressing the issues. This is supported by a number of theologians (including Dominicans I note) in the following statement:
http://www.cbhd.org/resources/stemcells/jointstatment_2005-06-20.htm
Others have argued against such an approach however. I would be interested in your view.
I will leave it at that for the moment.
Thank you.
Pat Duignan
May 29, 2008 at 10:13 am
Thanks a lot for your feedback. By the way, may i know your background or why are you interested in bioethics. One does not find people interested in complicating their lives with these conundrums very often. I teach bioethics at the major seminary here in Singapore.
Thanks also for the link. Interesting proposal! I had heard about something like this ANT butfor some reason scientists do not fall for it. In principle, if human embryos are not harmed or destroyed, it seems that there would be nothing wrong with it. But it also raises the use of what constitutes a human embryo. Which is also a challenge. So, what is your take on it?
June 12, 2008 at 6:21 pm
Fr David,
My apologies for not replying earlier. I am a layman from New Zealand and have been celebrating my 60th birthday as it happens with a number of visitors form other parts of New Zealand and overseas. I have a general interest in many aspects of science, ethics and politics but cannot claim to be an expert in any of them. I have degrees in Physics and Economics and have served as an economist most of my career.
Our discussion group was very interested in your views and indeed tended to identify with your comments dated May 25.
As to the ANT concept I can see it playing a part in some possible developments in the area. One core issue for ethics seems to me to be that most ethical issues are about human decisions where the details of the situation are not the central aspect. In the area we are discussing however the details are becoming the central focus. If it turns out that manipulation of a few base pairs of DNA becomes the ethical dividing line the ethical guidance may not be very robust. I do not however know of any alternative approach.
So I am left concerned at where the ethical discussion is proceeding.
I realise the above is unsatisfactorily vague but I trust you will perceive the point anyway.
I will leave it at that for the moment but look forward to keeping in touch. I will send my email address to Fr Antonio Gonzalez’s email address which is shown on this site.
Pat
August 6, 2008 at 10:12 am
Thanks Pat, sorry for replying only so late. And thanks also for leaving the message with Fr. Antonio.
Regarding intervention in the DNA chain, i think we should not concerned about how much DNA we are tampering with, but what that DNA section does.
If I am contemplating to cut a vein that i do not know what it does, the right course of action is to inform myself fully about the consequences of my action. And this is the tough part about Genetic intervention. We know too little.
If one day we know what this DNA section does exactly then the morality of the intervention can be rightly assessed. In the mean time, it is not responsible to act in ignorance.